MOOD INDIGO
Maverick soundscapist Vaal – the artist also known as Eliot Sumner, and formerly known as Coco – is back with an immersive new album, laden with lush electronic textures and moody, trip hop inspired beats. We talk to the elusive music maker about anonymity, astrology, devils and identities. Oh, and James Bond.
Interview Adam Mattera Photography Christian Trippe Styling Stevie Gatez
Jacket and Shirt – Tamar Keburia, Trouser – ESAÚ YORI, Shoes – A-JANE
Let’s start with the new Vaal album – Love Reversed. Did you have a specific direction in mind when you were making it?
I’d been listening to a lot of Massive Attack and Unkle, Chemical Brothers as well. So it’s quite trip hop inspired, but there’s a lot of electronica in there too. I definitely wanted more of a cinematic sound and a more human feel to it than Nosferatu (the first Vaal album).
Interesting you say that, parts of it really felt like a movie soundtrack to me. Numbing Agent has a very Giorgio Moroder-esque feel to it, the mood reminded me of his Midnight Express soundtrack. Are there any film scores that are particular favourites of yours?
Did you ever see Moon by Duncan Jones? Clint Mansell did the score for that. That’s one I go back to again and again. I actually got the chance to work with Clint a few years ago which was amazing. I got to work with my hero.
I actually just came across the version of Radiohead’s Creep you did together… it’s fantastic.
Thanks, I was pretty happy with that. I actually just sent him the new album and he liked it so that was good to hear.
Jacket – ESAÚ YORI, T-Shirt – RE/DONE, Denim – RE/DONE, Shoes – Axel Arigato
"I prefer working alone. It's a very intimate and private thing. I've always been a bit of a lone wolf."
I imagine when you’re working on music, it’s usually quite a solitary pursuit? Just you alone in your home studio.
Pretty much. I get a bit anxious if there’s someone else in the room. It feels like there’s this pressure to come up with something on the spot. I prefer working alone. It’s a very intimate and private thing. I’ve always been a bit of a lone wolf.
I’m sure I read in an old interview that you lived on your own in a cottage in the middle of nowhere for a while?
Yeah, I still do, outside Salisbury. But I think what you’re referring to is when I lived in the Lake District for about nine months. But I’m actually moving to New York in a couple of days time.
Like you do! How come?
I think it’s time. It’s a pretty extreme lifestyle change from the middle of nowhere to the busiest city in the world, but I’m ready. I needed that time to spend alone in nature and not see many people. Lockdown was kind of perfect for me. I mean, obviously what was happening was just terrible, but the situation gave me an opportunity to kind of recalibrate. For years before that I would be on a plane maybe three times a week and that can be really stressful.
You’re talking about your DJ-ing career, right?
Yeah, I was a touring DJ for like six years. As someone that suffers from severe anxiety, I don’t think that lifestyle really suited me. Don’t get me wrong, I had some great times during all that. But learning what it feels like to be settled in one place felt really good.
I want to go onto your DJ life in a bit, but first can we go back to the beginning of your music career? I read you wrote your first song when you were like five or something ridiculous.
No, I wasn’t five. (Laughs) Maybe 13 or 14. I discovered that writing a song can really make you feel better and help you understand what you’re experiencing emotionally. That was a good discovery. It’s a shame though, because now I can only really write songs when I’m in complete existential crisis. If I’m really happy I feel completely numb and I can’t write anything.
You signed your first record deal when you were 17 (releasing an electro-pop album under the band name I Blame Coco). Was it always your plan to get into the music business?
Not really, It kind of just happened. I always I wanted to play guitar, that was my thing. But I was very young. Too young. I think you need to give yourself time to hone in on who you are and the kind of music you want to make. Because all of your trials and errors will be on the internet for the rest of your life. But I’m at peace with it now.
Suit – ESAÚ YORI, Hat – Serratelli, Shoes – Axel Arigato
I know you don’t really like talking about your parents, but there’s such an obvious connection here with your dad being a famous rock star. (Eliot’s dad is Gordon Sumner, aka Sting). Was that more of a help or a hindrance? Did he encourage you?
Of course he was encouraging (long pause)… I think it’s you know, it makes it a bit of an obstacle. Which is okay. We’ve all got obstacles to.… I don’t know where I’m going with this. It’s been a while since I’ve done interviews.
No, it’s fine.
To be honest it’s more of an internalised stigma, and that can feel very real sometimes. Well it did at that time when I was very young. I’m 32 now, so it’s a long time ago.
Well you don’t look 32. I think you could get away with 25.
You’re going to make me blush.
"I wanted something where no one could make the connection that it was me. I based it on my favourite artists who are completely faceless and nameless, people like Burial and Daft Punk. Banksy even."
Eliot on choosing the pseudonym Vaal
So that journey from I Blame Coco to where you are now – it was a couple of years after that situation that you started putting out music under the name Vaal. Where did that name come from?
I wanted something where no one could make the connection that it was me. I based it on my favourite artists who are completely faceless and nameless, people like Burial and Daft Punk. Banksy even. I wanted to do a project where the music would speak for itself, to create something that was completely against what I’d put out before and I wasn’t really that proud of. It means ‘whale’ in a few Baltic languages. And I think it means ‘faded’ in Dutch… so it kind of fits the music. I liked the ambiguity around it.
So when you first began exploring the techno DJ world was that as Vaal or as Eliot?
That was as Vaal. But the whole thing was a complete accident. I was just playing around with my keyboards and eventually it was like ‘I think I just made a techno record!’ So I sent it to some DJ friends of mine and said ‘I’m not sure who this is, but you might like it’. And then my friend Luca called me and said ‘Who is this? Because (techno label) Life and Death are really interested in signing him.’
So that’s when you first started to DJ as Vaal?
Yeah, the label were doing the Sonar showcase and wanted me to play. So I taught myself to DJ. And that’s when all the touring started. It was mad.
I’m sure I’ve read a quote where you said you actually don’t like clubbing?
Not really. If I’m up for it, I love it. But I like having a reason to be there. You know what I mean? You’re in a booth and you’re sort of protected from the outside world.
So you don’t have punters coming up saying ‘can you play Beyoncé?’. Maybe that doesn’t happen in techno clubs?
Pretty unlikely, yeah (laughs). But actually I was having a lot of fun because I felt completely anonymous. It was a world that I had no history in, so it was all new and exciting. I wasn’t trying to prove anything to myself or anyone.
And you managed to keep your identity under wraps?
For quite a long time, yeah, but in that world, no one really cares. It’s not like the indie world or the rock’n’roll world where there’s all this scrutiny on your backstory. Everyone in the underground electronic world is just there for the music. It seems very anti-celebrity, which I love.
You’ve mentioned that need for anonymity a few times now. I have to ask the obvious – how much is that to do with the expectations around being the child of famous parents?
It’s definitely part of it. But it’s more about wanting to change everything that I’ve done before. I am my own worst critic. So it comes from a more internalised stigma. That’s something I’m still working out.
What star sign are you?
I’m a Leo, but my moon is in Scorpio. Scorpio is supposed to be a lot about rebirth, but also they can be quite dark and very emotionally intense.
Suit – ESAÚ YORI, Hat – Serratelli, Shoes – Axel Arigato
On the new album there’s a couple of guest vocalists – I particularly like Liam Bailey on the track Tragedy. It’s interesting you’ve chosen not to sing – your voice was so central to your early records and the stuff you released as Eliot Sumner.
I think that’s because at the beginning, Vaal was very much born out of having completely unknown identity like I said. But actually that’s my voice on the title track – but it’s played backwards. It’s me singing Silent Night. I originally recorded it for a Christmas movie, but they didn’t use it because it was a bit too sinister and dark. I think they ended up using the Michael Bublé version instead. (Laughs)
I’m struck by how different all the music you’ve made under these different identities – Coco, Eliot, Vaal… do you see those three personas of being almost different people?
I don’t really know what it is exactly. It’s almost like I’ll hate the version of myself from six months ago. But now it’s becoming more and more… I’m making peace with myself. I’m a lot more collaborative with those other sides of me. I’ll probably be singing on the next Vaal record, and maybe one day there’ll be one person. I’m definitely in a better headspace about it now.
"It’s almost like I’ll hate the version of myself from six months ago. But now I'm making peace with myself. I'm a lot more collaborative with those other sides of me. Maybe one day there'll be one person."
Eliot on his multiple musical identities
Shirt – Axel Arigato, Hoodie – Corteiz, Trousers – Igor Dieryck
Can we talk a little about some of your film work? I saw there’s something called Inferno coming up – that sounded intriguing.
Do you know the artist Mimmo Paladino? He’s an Italian artist who makes these arthouse films, and he cast me as Lucifer.
Did you get to have horns and a tail?
Oh no. It wasn’t a sort of costume drama. I was already born with a very malevolent face. I don’t need horns.
You’ve appeared in a quite impressive list of films – (Guy Ritchie’s 2019 thriller) The Gentlemen, and of course the last James Bond…
Yeah. But they cut my scene out, I think it was too violent. You can see me for like a split second. But it’s fine, I’m working through it. (Laughs)
Did you get to hang with Daniel?
I did. It was the only time I’ve ever been starstruck – meeting DC.
Oh, is that what his friends call him, DC?
No, it’s just what I call him. (Laughs) He was really cool to work with.
I hear you’re a huge Bond geek. What’s your favourite Bond film?
Yeah massive. Oh, my God, that’s a difficult one. There are so many I can’t say. I was raised on GoldenEye and Tomorrow Never Dies. You know, the Brosnan years? But then, Daniel very quickly and brilliantly took that role and made it his own.
You could end up doing the music for the next one. You should hook up with that guy would does them, David Arnold isn’t it? Do you know him?
I don’t. But I know people who know him. There might be an in there. But I think I’d rather be in another Bond film than do the soundtrack.
As a villain, obviously.
Obviously, yeah, I can only play villains. There’s nothing benevolent about my face.
TEAM CREDITS
Interview Adam Mattera
Photographer Christian Trippe
Grooming Paris France
Styling Stevie Gatez
Styling assistant Emma
Photo assistant Lucian Koncz
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